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#4: HG MTS System

posted May 14, 2019, 5:24 AM by Jeff Ogden   [ updated May 14, 2019, 5:55 AM ]
On 9 May 2019, at 10:31, Jeff Ogden wrote:

What model of IBM 370 computer was used at Human Genetics to run MTS? A 4341? A 4331? Something else?

Do you remember approximately what year the HG system was installed?

What role did the Computing Center play with the HG system? Did it maintain MTS? Anything else?


On May 9, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Steve Burling wrote:

My memory on all this is very vague. I think it was a 4341, but hell if I can remember the dates. I think I consulted with them a few times, but don't remember being actively involved in the maintenance of their system. I can't find anything in my email archives where I communicated with the guy at HG (Paul Kopec) about anything MTS related.

-- Steve

On May 9, 2019, at 12:33 PM, Thomas Valerio wrote:

I might be able to dig through some archive/update files of the UMPS
account to get some answers regarding the HG system.  Also Jim Bodwin may
recall some of the details of the HG system. 

  -- Tom/

On May 9, 2019, at 4:42 PM, Jim Bodwin wrote:

I can confirm that it was a 4341 but I don't remember the dates.  It was around the same time as the switch to the 3090.  I thought that there was a note in the CC newsletter shortly after it was installed.  I found a reference to it in the index for Volume 2 (4:16) (which would be 1986, I think) but I could not find the actual newsletter issue online.

We managed the system - all software updates, reboots, etc.  I do remember that MTS didn't have a way to change to/from daylight savings time without a reboot.  I went over once on the Monday after the DST switch to reboot it and discovered that it hadn't been rebooted since the previous DST switch.  I think that it was still running when I left in 1989.

  - Jim

On May 9, 2019, at 6:32 PM, Mike Alexander wrote:

As I mentioned to Jeff in another message, I have an EMail archive of 367 messages related to HG.  I sent this to Jeff, I can send it to anyone else who wants it.  Here is a relevant message:

Date: Tue, 4 Mar 86 16:01:46 EDT
From: Thomas.D.Berry@um.cc.umich.edu
Subject: Machine configuration
To: Andy.Goodrich@um.cc.umich.edu

I have a tentative hardware configuration for the IBM 4361 along with a
tentative budget. I would greatly appreciate an evaluation by you and your
to make sure we are in the right ball park. We are pushing our budget a
little depending on the final discount from IBM. We were given a 44%
discount on the first try but it might not be as great this time due to
the exclusion of the operating system. One item that is not included
but should be considered is the Resource Manager. Steve Peterson from
Simon Fraser would be glad to help us get it going and we could include
some money for his assistance. I believe he estimated 3 weeks time. It
is my understanding that we could live with HASP for a while under the
proposed configuration if we are willing to sacrifice .24 gb disk
space for a spooler (ugh!). Depending on the estimated implementation
for the RM at the CC I believe I would rather wait and be running
the same version of MTS as the Center.

Here is the configuration/budget:

                                                     44%     Monthly
          Description        List Price        discount       Maint.

   4361-MDL4 (16mb mem)     $242,200.00     $135,632.00      $854.00
   1422 Blk Mpx               $3,340.00       $1,870.40        $3.00
   1431 high spd BLKMPX       $4,760.00       $2,665.60        $3.00

   3205 Color console         $2,895.00       $1,621.20       $24.75

   3880-3 controller         $60,270.00      $33,751.20      $176.00
   3380-AD4 2.5 gb Disk      $88,780.00      $49,716.80      $295.00

   3430 Tape & cntrl         $33,400.00      $18,704.00      $251.00
   3430 Tape drive           $16,900.00       $9,464.00      $176.00

   4245 Line printer         $28,000.00      $15,680.00      $300.00
   3262 Alarm                   $201.00         $112.56

   IBM Hardware             $480,746.00     $269,217.76    $2,082.75

   4654 Acrith sub lib        $6,000.00       $3,600.00
   5748 FORTRAN comp            $558.00         $334.80      $186.00
   5799 Elem Math Lib           $300.00         $180.00
   5796 PASCAL comp           $5,670.00       $3,402.00

   IBM software              $12,528.00       $7,516.80      $186.00

   IBM Total                                $276,734.56    $2,268.75

   ORACLE RDBMS                               $5,400.00      $975.00
          SQL                                 $1,080.00
          SQLT                                $1,080.00
          SQL Link                            $1,080.00
          Protocol                              $720.00
   ORACLE - for 10 AT's                       $3,200.00      $266.67
   ORACLE - installation                      $3,000.00
   ORACLE - support                          $11,700.00

   IBM Hardware                             $269,217.76    $2,082.75
   IBM Software                               $7,516.80      $186.00
   PCP                                       $26,000.00
   ORACLE                                    $27,260.00    $1,241.67
   MIDAS                                      $1,200.00
   Room modifications                         $3,000.00
   CC support                                $20,000.00    $1,500.00

   TOTAL                                    $354,194.56    $5,010.42

   Yearly maint                                           $60,125.00

A few things are not obvious from the budget so let me reiterate them here.
Processor - IBM 4361 mdl4
            16 mb memory
            floating point processor
            8 mb cahe memory
2 block MPX channels
1 high speed BMPX channel

Any questions, let me know.
                            Thanks, Dinny

I also have a long message from Jim critiquing this configuration and suggesting alternatives.  I didn’t yet find one giving the final configuration they got, but it’s probably in there somewhere.  My EMail archive from that period is fairly complete.


And from Mike Alexander's e-mail archive:

Date: Fri, 7 Feb 86 11:28:34 EDT
From: Thomas.D.Berry@um.cc.umich.edu
Subject: Human Genetics
To: Jeff.Ogden@um.cc.umich.edu

At the Department of Human Genetics we are in the process of replacing
our PDP 11/70 computing system. We are considering either an IBM 4361
model 4 running VM/SP or a VAX 11/785 running VMS 4.2. Because this
facility will be supporting researchers from different parts of the country
(and different countries for that matter) we would like to do everything
possible to ensure the best possible link to the network. We presently
have two SCP's (11/23) which we are using to connect the PDP 11/70
and VAX 11/750 to the network as async hosts. I have worked out the
details the VAX 11/785 connection but I am unclear as to the options
for connecting the IBM 4361. At a recent IBM presentation Kathy Edwards
mentioned that you were working with the University Libraries to connect
their IBM to the network. We would be in a position to consider the
purchase of a PCP if that would increase the ease and/or functionality
of our connection.

                Thanks for your help
                                      Dennis Berry